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Side Story #2 Scripted Loss, Part II

🕑 Added 2023-05-31 16:15:01 +0000 UTC

Comments

Aaron Weingrad

Herero couples have ethical concerns and problems too. Should women pay poor women to save wear and tear on their bodies? There are women paying younger poor women so that they don’t get stretch marks or so they can focus on their careers. They are making more embryos than they need and aborting the unwanted ones. Everyone wants to focus on the easiest to justify cases where a couple has done all they can and have terrible luck with fertility, but even there it gets thorny. People tend to Motte and Bailey the issue. Present a tragic story of a stable and loving couple who just can’t get pregnant. But then once this is accepted they move the goal post to saying that we cant justify anyone else being denied these arrangements. We as a society have pushed women to get a college education and establish a career before trying to start a family. Some of the bigger tech companies are offering the employment benefit of freezing their eggs and paying for IVF and if you are high enough up even paying for surrogacy. How is this any less creepy than Starbright doing all this for their employees? Or if it isn’t creepy to you then why is what Sophia and Jun doing supposed to be awful? They are being unromantic and pragmatic about it. But is that really the only thing that is needed to make it ethical and moral? Like if Jun and Sophia were all sappy about it then it is moral? And it isn’t like the younger poorer women renting out their wombs IRL are doing so out of some romantic notions of love for their fellow man. They are doing it for the cash. And homosexual couples really are prioritizing their sexual desires over any costs to the children they are buying or to the women they pay to commodify their bodies. It is a rough deal to have your sexual preference be one that is inherently sterile. Overcoming this by renting a woman’s womb or denying a kid a relationship with their mother is obviously problematic.

gostsamo

just saying, but surrogacy is used as well by heterosexual couples where the woman cannot conceive for one reason or another.

Al

Haha what the fuck?

Aaron Weingrad

Don’t think I will “get out of here”. Now what? I have a friend who’s dad came out as gay after his mother died. He honorably raised three kids and stuck by his wife for decades. I don’t actually believe he was innately bi. You going to say his marriage was a sham? That my friends dad faked his love for his wife and the family they built? Yes. Older generation and perhaps he wouldn’t have built the life he did now. Hard for me to look at my friend’s existence and say “what a shame. Wish that his family had never existed”. Life is more complicated than “I’m gay therefor I have no control over who I build a life with and how”. There are trade offs. Men cannot have kids together. The ethics of abandoning the biological necessities that underpinned family formation are only simple to idiots. Surrogacy is a thing. If we think that is fine and wonderful then what is your problem with Nephillim surrogacy? Is this story and Sophia bigoted? Why shouldn’t we all celebrate LGBTQN(ephillim). Love is love. What exactly is wrong with loving a being from a higher dimension? Gay men don’t choose their appetites any more than Jun does in the story. Jun wants the person she chose. She is just as constrained and distorted by her civilization and it’s discontents as any gay guy ever was. Is she not allowed to pursue her idea of a family? If you don’t think so doesn’t that make you a bigot? Sophia controls her own body. You want to make healthcare choices for Sophia? Sex work is work, right? Seems like you are a bigot. Or the story raises no issues. The rainbow flag has overcome all the ethical and normative issues and difficulties that have been part of relationships and family formation for all of human history. Who knew all we had to do was embrace queerdom and any technological or institutional difficulties are done with. It is only homophobia that kept us from all finding happiness without costs and tradeoffs.

Kris Bruns

Also most gay or lesbain that want to start a family do this called adoption. Maybe you've heard of it?

Kris Bruns

I'm sorry did you just suggest that gay men can "Give Up" their sexual prefrences? That some bull shit there. Gay men don't choose to be gay, they're born that way. Take your homophobic BS and get out of here.

Aaron Weingrad

We currently live in a society with surrogacy and it is touted as a really positive thing. Gay dudes who refuse to give up their sexual preference will just rent a woman’s womb. There is a narrative that says this is moral in a utilitarian sense. Woman gets $. Men get baby and the sexual relations they prefer. Baby gets to exist. But if you look harshly at it the whole thing can seem almost as monstrous as this side story. Men cannot live with the tradeoffs of satisfying their sexual needs as they prefer and value this desire more than the identity of being a father in a family. Woman commodifies the most fundamental aspect of her nature. Sells the baby she creates to a couple of guys who base their identity around sexual appetite. Baby is raised without knowing their mother. All the arguments you could use to justify and promote surrogacy IRL are as easily applied to this side story. There is no reason Sophia shouldn’t profit any more than a real surrogate mother. Isn’t it just bigotry for us to see the blended family with the nephilim baby as somehow unnatural? Disgust at cooking sperm up in a lab or having half breed children is hateful by most bio-ethicists, correct? If Sophia isn’t lying and will follow through on her agreement then how is this worse than the world we currently live in? Great side story. Very thought provoking

Daniel Sifrit

And the sad part is Sophia seems to fit right in...

Jordan

I find myself hoping that Truth takes the offer to become a sabatoure more and more. Just so he can go John Wick on everyone.

The Golem Crafter

Dear lord, what kind of fucked up society is that! To be considering this instead of bailing the hell out of there is amazingly desperate

Nonnyor Business

Good catches. Fixed.

gostsamo

edit suggestions: fiest -> feast over Sophia’shoulder -> Sophia's shoulder (unless intentional)


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